Invasion: Divine Beyond

Mon Nov 15, 2010 8:59 pm

After the "incident" that was the Invasion Customs Night I ran, I've decided that I want to make a custom Invasion map that will actually work. So here is the idea for "Divine Beyond":

The Covenant have obtained the Sacred Icon and are planning on firing the Halo Ring to begin the Great Journey. They have set up AA guns on the ridge surrounding the control room to fend off UNSC air support. The fate of the galaxy rests on a small, elite group of SPARTAN-IIIs to infiltrate the Control Room and extricate the Sacred Icon.

SPARTANs' objectives/phases:

Territories/Assault(unlikely): Take out/capture the covenant AA guns to allow for tactical air support.
Territories: Set up Targeting Beacon at weak points in the Control Room structure to allow for Longsword air strike.
CTF/Territories(unlikely): Infiltrate the control room and wrest control of the icon from the Covenant's hands. Transport the Icon to nearby extraction zone to ensure the Covenant cannot use the Ring again.

I'm going to be sticking to the basic weaponry/loadouts as Spire and Boneyard, but I am also hoping to make some tweaks that will make the map its own unique experience. Ideas so far:

Weapons/vehicles by tier:

- Spartan Weapons: None (following Spire's example with Spartans attacking)
- Elite Weapons: Needle Rifles (3, following Spire yet again)
- Spartan Weapons: Sniper?/Rockets? Vehicles: Falcon (first tweak, would make sense with removal of AA guns)
- Elite Weapons: Plasma Launcher and Focus Rifle
- Spartan Weapons: Spartan Laser (set on high respawn time). Vehicles: Chain Warthog.
- Elite Weapons: Fuel Rod Cannon. Vehicles: Banshee (and maybe Wraith)

Areas of Forgeworld I'm thinking of using:

I like the idea of using Alaska/Montana as the area for the 2 AA guns. However, I do not yet have an idea on how to have Spartans start spawns without a) being split up b) too far away from objectives. Ideas would be appreciated.
Place the Control Room in the Canyon (definitely), which section (seaside, caveside, inbetween) is still sketchy, likely to be closer to the AA guns. Transitions between Tier 1 and 2 are a complication.
Final destination is likely to be in the general direction of Spartan spawns (Think Boneyard's layout: Elites push to Ship, into base, pull core back out of base towards the ship so its closer to Elite Spawns while still going to a section of the map still unused)

Please, when posting ideas/feedback, keep in mind that this is an extra rough draft and can change at any time. Keep the criticism constructive and please be gentle when you blow my ideas out of the water.

Thanks,
Valkyrion

YouTube · Mon Nov 15, 2010 9:19 pm

I posted a lot of my ideas about Invasion Forging here.

So far I'm pretty cool with your idea. I would add that your vehicles should spawn in the tier 1 offensive zone for Spartans. I suggest you make the elite vehicle spawn protected.

I personally think you should have the hog appear at Tier 2 and not the Falcon. AA guns being down means we can get the air support when we need it, but not necessarily that it should arrive immediately in the form of a Falcon. Also, a Falcon at Tier 2 kinda makes the Hog seem insignificant in Tier 3. In addition, the elites have no effective way to take down a Falcon without their plasma launcher. On spire, the Elites have a Banshee to dogfight with the Falcon.

If you're going to give the Spartans a laser, then the Elites HAVE to have a Wraith, though good luck balancing that. Laser is controlled on Boneyard by the difficulty in using it.

As for keeping the map in one area, you can build some sort of large base in the Boneyard style, where tier 2 is unlocking the core or something, and tier 3 is going inside to get it out.

Mon Nov 15, 2010 11:47 pm

If I happen to be online while ur making this, pop me an invite! I think much better when the map is in front of me ::thumbs::

mabey i can help!

Wed Nov 17, 2010 3:13 pm

@Sarge: Thanks for the feedback. I have read your conceptualization on Invasion and completely agree with your points. When I formulated my ideas, I took your points into account and plan on implementing them the best I can. I was thinking that the Spartan escape was mostly going to be based on land, so I figured having a good ground vehicle would make sense in the context. However, after giving it more thought (I had essentially written up the concept right before I went to bed), the Warthog would probably be best in Tier 2. I realized from the get-go that the Elites would have trouble killing the Falcon, I was just defiantly hoping I could balance it some way. But hey, that's why this is a rough draft.

I still really want the Laser on the map at some point, despite the difficulties. I'll just have to study Boneyard a bit for ideas.

@Twisted: As for when I'm forging this, I have no idea. It may happen soon, or maybe in the far future. Creating it may take a long while. But time isn't going to stop me from making this work.

Sat Nov 20, 2010 2:55 pm

I've started to forge the 1st phase of the map. So far, only 1 AA gun. This should be the one that won't change; the other gun will vary in position.

First pic: General overview of AA gun on Montana's "Pride Rock," possible bridge between Montana and Alaska, the area (in red) of a possible site for the second AA gun, and the area (in green) where I would place the Control Room should I place the 2nd AA gun in the red-circled area.

Second Pic: Another overview, this time with a different area for the 2nd AA gun (still in red) and the Control Room (still in green).

3rd Pic: Closer Look at the gun, also showing side ramp and backdoor entrance to the base. I'm thinking of having the Elites spawn inside the base and blocking the entrances with shield doors to prevent spawn camping.

4th Pic: Same thing, different angle. As you can see, a 1-way shield door blocks the skylight of the bunker. The catch? Players can jump up into the skylight and the shield door will lift them through! Easy way for the Elites to get on top of the base. It may need fixing, however, as I plan on making the territory marker on top of the base. Elites spawning inside the base may be able to reach the territory too quickly to contest it. Still needs some thinking-through.

Final Shot: From an observer's standpoint. For scale, a lone spartan stands on the hill leading up to the gun.

Once again, any feedback/help is great.

Sat Nov 20, 2010 4:25 pm

The AA gun looks amazing

Sat Nov 20, 2010 8:37 pm

If you're going to make you scenery that detailed, you may hit the object limit by placing weapons, vehicles and objectives. based on your design, I'm questioning whether you even need 2 guns. Why not 1 gun and a power plant or something. That way you won't use as many objects, maintain your story line and still have 2 objectives to go after.

Sat Nov 20, 2010 9:34 pm

I would take out the green area as thats going to lead to a huge play area.

Instead you could have another AA gun on the opposite side of the current one and they could serve as tier 1/2 objectives. This could be Assault and the explosion could blow up the AA gun which would be easy to achieve.

The AA guns look sick though and you have used your budget well for these.

Sun Nov 21, 2010 12:49 pm

RJ wrote:
If you're going to make you scenery that detailed, you may hit the object limit by placing weapons, vehicles and objectives. based on your design, I'm questioning whether you even need 2 guns. Why not 1 gun and a power plant or something. That way you won't use as many objects, maintain your story line and still have 2 objectives to go after.

BK wrote:
I would take out the green area as thats going to lead to a huge play area.

Instead you could have another AA gun on the opposite side of the current one and they could serve as tier 1/2 objectives. This could be Assault and the explosion could blow up the AA gun which would be easy to achieve.

The AA guns look sick though and you have used your budget well for these.

Currently, I believe I have about $8210 left in the budget to make the second AA gun, the Control Room (interior/exterior), natural cover (and possibly a Spartan starting spawn), and weapons and vehicles. Not wanting to sacrifice gameplay for aesthetics, I'll be spawning in all weapons/vehicles before making any more progress. Also, a power plant would likely use up the same amount of resources as an AA gun. Regardless, I'm glad that the gun looks good while being frugal.

The green area will be sectioned off appropriately to ensure a smaller play area, if that was unclear (I'm most certainly not using the whole gulch).

However, I'd really like feedback from you all on the position of the second AA gun for the 1st phase (assuming I keep with my original plan): Montana or Alaska? Montana is linked and easier for elites to transition between, but Alaska would allow the Spartans to have 2 more natural routes of escaping the with the core: the Alaska/Montana Gorge or the Cave Pass.

Another thing that is escaping me is getting down from Montana/Alaska without dying. I've tried Mancannons (a la Spire's yellow vents) and wound up splattered on the ground. Teleporters with multiple receiver nodes seem somewhat viable to prevent teleport camping, but the budget cost may not be worth it. Finally, perhaps natural routes down from the ridges would be best.

At this rate, I'm at the Forger's equivalent of writer's block, so any ideas on the previous questions would be excellent.

YouTube · Sun Nov 21, 2010 12:56 pm

I like your AA gun. My concern, as it is for most FW Invasion maps is that we'll be playing in multiple section of FW and the map will feel disjointed and too large.

Thu Nov 25, 2010 3:23 am

I'm confused about the map set up...

Where will the spartans spawn in Tier 1? Are you planning on using Alaska, Montana, AND some parts of Hemmorhage?

Alaska, that bridge you made, and Montana are all pretty huge spaces already and adding a whole other tier under them as well as walling it off sounds like too big of an endeavor (IMO).

Depending on the spawn situation you could attach walkways and buildings to the underside of "Pride Rock". This tier would be the access route to the Core at the bottom of "Pride Rock". You could use the original spawns as vehicle depots for a spartan Falcon and an elite Wraith. The wraith would be handy in preventing the spartans from even getting to the AA gun/Pride Rock and the Falcon would be great for clearing elites off of the walkways down undah and, of course, taking down the wraith.

At tier 2 the spartans will need some cover so maybe a mobile command center on Montana that gets "lifted in" so that they dont have to cross the bridge... unless you wanted to place power weapons (laser) there.

Looks good so far though! Lookin forward to it.

Mon Nov 29, 2010 8:33 am

After some thought, I've scrapped the idea for a control room in the Gulch. Instead I've decided to constrain the map to Montana and Alaska. So here is what I have so far; I still have $2350 left in the budget to add other features.

1st pic: Tier one with the AA guns finished. The Bunkers are sealed off with 1-way shield doors, as I plan on having elites spawn inside.

2nd pic: Completed bridge with 1-way shield door and shield door batteries.

3rd pic: The control room. Still incomplete; I plan on having it completely sealed by the end of this project. Focus Rifle Spawns on the large walkway on the left of the pic, Plasma Launcher on the right. Tier 2/3 Elite spawns will likely be behind the Room. Please note that weapons and vehicle locations are not finallized; right now they are there to make sure I don't go over-budget.

A view of the control room with the Tier 3 capture point on the cliff ridge. I may adjust the capture point if it proves too far away for the Spartans.

A view of one of the capture zones and the doors to the control room.

Finally, a pic of the catwalks inside the control room. I'm planning on completely redoing them to make the layout more square. I also plan on making a kill ball in the center so that part of it obstructs the view of from one side of the catwalk to the other. I found that kill balls also block line of effect (your clear shot) like a window or shield door.

Current concerns: Control room may be too far away from Tier 1. Vehicles will still spawn at Tier 1 Spartan spawns (somewhere beneath the view of the 1st pic), but Tier 2 spartan spawns will likely be much closer than the AA guns. Bottom line: it would really suck to have to move the control room. ::FP::

Mon Jan 24, 2011 4:25 pm

Reviving this thread for discussion of the map instead of making a new thread. Anyone who has some ideas for it is encouraged to post them.

Mon Jan 24, 2011 4:45 pm

There's no set guide to make Invasion maps. Bungie will be looking for unique and innovative maps and if you just build maps the way Bungie has it's not going to be anything new or innovative. This is one of the reasons the Invasion map that won the forgetacular contest did so as it was highly innovative.

I wouldn't worry about time being a factor in crossing the bridge as it's the most reliable method which new players will understand. Manncannons are highly unreliable and your a sitting duck for elite needle rifle team shooting. With portals your coming out at a choke point and a good elite team will be able to take advantage of this as well as parking their vehicles to block the portals.

That's the drawbacks and con's I see of those two methods. I would just have the warthog spawn at tier 1 regardless of how it's done on other maps as it makes the most sense imo to do this for your map.

I still think this map has great potential and I'm looking forward to play testing newer version.

Mon Jan 24, 2011 4:58 pm

I may have been mistaken about the falcon hehe. I never saw where it spawned but I know I saw it at the top of that tower at one point while I was on defense.

I like black knights idea of a partially destroyed bridge being placed at the end of Tier 1, that the Spartans can use going one way but not the other (scrap my bridge vehicle-man cannon idea). But I do think a few man cannons or teleporters across the canyon in other places than the current bridge would be good. More than 1 entrance would balance a lot of things out for tier 3 Spartans. More options = win I always think

Perhaps you could do the man cannons and spawns this way. Left side team spawn has access to 2 man cannons, 1 goes to the left side (straight across the canyon), 1 goes to middle. Middle spawn has access to 3, one goes left, one straight, one right. Right side access to the bridge and hog.

I don't think the hog at the back is bad necessarily because it can still cover a lot of ground quickly. Maybe put it on a shorter respawn time though so it sees more play?

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